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ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN I d like to welcome all of you to Massillon City Council for Monday, July 16, 2007. We have in attendance with us this evening: Safety Service Director Loudiana, Auditor Hamit and I understand Bob Zadell from the Law Department is supposed to be here but I don’t see him; so he may be joining us later. On the wall to your left are agendas for anyone who wishes to follow the meeting. Also under Item #5 on the agenda is where the public can speak on any item that appears on the agenda and then under item #17 is where the public can speak on any item that does not appear on the agenda. I d also like to remind anyone with a cell phone please turn it off or turn it very far down. 1. ROLL CALL Roll call for the evening found the following Council Members present: Tim Bryan, Kathy Catazaro-Perry, Jayne Ferrero, Chuck Maier, Ron Mang, Paul Manson, Donnie Peters and Tony Townsend. Thus giving a roll call vote of 8 present. COUNCILMAN BRYAN Councilman McCune is absent and for the record Council President Gamber is absent so as President Pro Tem I’ll chair the meeting tonight. I’ll look to Councilman Maier for a motion to excuse both Councilman McCune and Council President Gamber. COUNCILMAN MAIER I move to excuse Councilman McCune and Council President Gamber, seconded by Councilman Manson. Roll call vote of 7 yes, 1 no to excuse Councilman McCune and Council President Gamber. Peters voted no. 2. INVOCATION COUNCILMAN PETERS – Gave the invocation for tonight. 3. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE COUNCILMAN PETERS – Chairman of the Streets, Highways, Traffic and Safety Committee led those in attendance in the Pledge of Allegiance. 4. READING OF THE JOURNAL ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Madame Clerk are the minutes of the previous meeting transcribed and open for public viewing (THEY ARE) Are there any additions or corrections to the minutes. If not the minutes stand approved as written. 5. REMARKS OF DELEGATIONS AND CITIZENS TO MATTERS ON THE AGENDA 6. INTRODUCTION OF ORDINANCES AND RESOLUTIONS ORDINANCE NO. 84 2007 BY: COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT COMMITTEE Authorizing the Mayor of the City of Massillon, Ohio, to enter into an agreement with Kraft Power Corporation, providing for the adoption of a project which will establish a new facility, will result in the relocation and retention of 16 existing jobs and the creation of 6 new jobs over an 18 month period within the City of Massillon Enterprise Zone, and declaring an emergency. COUNCILMAN MANG This is the second council meeting now in a row that we’ve had a company interested in coming to our city and asking for a tax abatement. Again, this company is coming looking for a tax abatement along with building a new facility out on Millennium Blvd SE. 10 acres of ground has been purchased then about a 30,000 square foot facility the cost of the project is little over $3 million. With the new project there will be 16 existing jobs that will come forward to the city and that payroll is estimated about $800,000.00. They anticipate in the 18 months over a period of 18 months after they’re established that there will be a creation of 6 new jobs which will bring approximately $360,000.00 in additional to the payroll. The name of the company is Kraft Power Corporation at our work session we had three gentlemen from Kraft Power. They explained what they’re services are again it’s a company that specializes in services and assembly of the natural gas. As you recall a week or two before the company that sought and received a tax abatement was also in the gas associated work. These people I think the previous people install gas lines. So the move is on to make Massillon, Ohio the center of anything and everything related to gas. I will be asking for suspension of the rules unless council has questions regarding this company. COUNCILMAN MANG moved for suspension of the rules and passage, seconded by Councilman Townsend. COUNCILMAN MANSON Just one comment, this is probably going to be serviced by that trunk line, sewage trunk line that we approved the extension on, right? COUNCILMAN MANG I would think so. I would think they would be part of it, definitely. We’re starting to get our money back early. COUNCILMAN MANSON Yep, that’s right. When are they going to break ground, maybe you said it but I didn’t hear it? COUNCILMAN MANG They want to break ground now. I mean they were hoping that this body would pass this tonight so they can get this thing rolling. The rules were suspended by a roll call vote of 8 yes. ORDINANCE NO. 84 – 2007 WAS PASSED BY A ROLL CALL VOTE OF 8 YES. ORDINANCE NO. 85 2007 BY: HEALTH, WELFARE AND BLDG REGULATIONS Authorizing the Director of Public Service and Safety of the City of Massillon, Ohio, to enter into a contract with Love Insurance Agency for boiler and machinery insurance and crime insurance coverage, and declaring an emergency. COUNCILWOMAN FERRERO This is just a simple renewal of two policies that we have right now with Love Insurance Agency. One for boiler and machinery insurance and for the crime policy for 2007 and 2008. That policy renewal date is August 1st, so I am going to be asking for suspension of the rules. The boiler and machinery insurance is $6,310.00, crime is $890.00 and there is no increase from last year. So if there’s any questions I’d be happy to have Mr. Loudiana answer anything that you may want to know. Otherwise I will be asking for suspension. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Councilwoman Ferrero will you make your motion first and then I’ll ask for the questions after we get a second. COUNCILWOMAN FERRERO moved for suspension of the rules and passage, seconded by Councilman Manson. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Now are there any questions or comments on the ordinance? The rules were suspended by a roll call vote of 8 yes. ORDINANCE NO. 85 – 2007 WAS PASSED BY A ROLL CALL VOTE OF 8 YES. ORDINANCE NO. 86 2007 BY: STREETS, HIGHWAYS, TRAFFIC AND SAFETY Authorizing the Director of Public Service and Safety of the City of Massillon, Ohio, to enter into an agreement with the Board of Stark County Commissioners, upon approval of the Board of Control, for the purchase of salt for ice control on the city streets, and declaring an emergency. COUNCILMAN PETERS Yes, this is just what it says it allows our Director of Public Service and Safety to buy our salt or enter into an agreement to purchase our salt for the streets for the winter. By participating in this program the price per dump truck delivered is $36.33 and $39.33 per piler truck delivered. Last year we paid $34.43 and the question is to why it was more this year what isn’t, but fuel is the biggest factor in that. So if there aren’t any questions I’m going to make a motion that we pass this tonight. COUNCILMAN PETERS moved for suspension of the rules and passage, seconded by Councilwoman Catazaro-Perry. The rules were suspended by a roll call vote of 8 yes. ORDINANCE NO. 86 – 2007 WAS PASSED BY A ROLL CALL VOTE OF 8 YES. ORDINANCE NO. 87 2007 BY: FINANCE COMMITTEE Making certain appropriations from the unappropriated balance of the Parking Enforcement Fund, 1401 Income Tax Capital Improvement Fund and the 1406 Wastewater Treatment Capital Improvement Fund, for the year ending December 31, 2007, and declaring an emergency. COUNCILWOMAN CATAZARO-PERRY Ordinance No. 87 – 2007 has three sections to it. Section 1, is to appropriate from the Parking Enforcement Fund $5,000.00 to an account entitled Services and Contract. This is for the Charles Street maintenance of the parking deck. Section 2, they’d like us to appropriate from 1401 Income Tax Capital Improvement Fund $2,000.00 for the engineering department for surveying supplies. Section 3, they’d like us to appropriate from 1406 Wastewater Treatment Capital Improvement Fund $1,935.00 to the account entitled Harsh Avenue Sanitary Sewer Relocation. COUNCILWOMAN CATAZARO-PERRY moved for suspension of the rules and passage, seconded by Councilman Peters. The rules were suspended by a roll call vote of 8 yes. ORDINANCE NO. 87 – 2007 WAS PASSED BY A ROLL CALL VOTE OF 8 YES. 7. UNFINISHED BUSINESS 8. PETITIONS AND GENERAL COMMUNICATIONS 9. BILLS, ACCOUNTS AND CLAIMS 1. INDEPENDENT – $483.88 COUNCILWOMAN CATAZARO-PERRY I move that we pay the bill, seconded by Councilman Peters. Roll call vote of 8 yes to pay the bill. 10. REPORTS FROM CITY OFFICIALS A). POLICE CHIEF SUBMITS MONTHLY REPORT FOR JUNE 2007. COPY FILE 11. REPORTS OF COMMITTEES ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Our next regular committee meetings will be held on the 30th of July at 5:45pm. Are there any special items from different committees? COUNCILWOMAN FERRERO Mr. Bryan, I would request that the Clerk please make sure that the law director, code officer and Mr. Loudiana are all notified that we would like to have them here and the police chief and probably Gary Mead, Officer Mead as well. If we could request those people to be here for that meeting so that we can finalize some discussion on our front yard parking. COUNCILMAN MANSON Yes, I know this is I’ve been out of town for a week on vacation. But I know this is causing a lot of discussion here in town this front yard parking. I’ve been approached by many people on both sides of this issue I think that I’d like to invite our TV station to come down and maybe tape the work session and watch some of the conversation that’s going on. I think it would be very interesting for the people who don’t attend council meetings to see how it’s being looked at. COUNCILWOMAN CATAZARO-PERRY Next week, the finance committee is going to be meeting to discuss the department reports and as soon as we determine the date we will all make sure that the media is aware of the meeting as well as all council members. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN And this will be during the day time some day next week. (Yes) Thank you. COUNCIL CLERK MARY BETH - I’m going to be off next week, just so everybody knows. 12. RESOLUTIONS AND REQUESTS OF COUNCIL MEMBERS 13. CALL OF THE CALENDAR 14. THIRD READING ORDINANCES AND RESOLUTIONS ORDINANCE NO. 74 2007 BY: POLICE AND FIRE COMMITTEE Repealing Section 761.09 “Schedule of Rates” under CHAPTER 761, “TOWING COMPANIES” of the Codified Ordinances of the City of Massillon, Ohio, and enacting new Section 761.09 “Schedule of Rates” under CHAPTER 761 “TOWING COMPANIES” of the Codified Ordinances of the City of Massillon, and declaring an emergency. COUNCILMAN MAIER Yes, we’ve given this ordinance three readings. There is…it’s been quite awhile since there’s been a rate increase and with the fuel costs and everything else I think the ordinance is in order. I’m going to make a motion that we bring this ordinance forward for its consideration. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Since its third reading you’re correct I believe to move for its passage. We still need a second. COUNCILMAN MAIER moved to bring Ordinance No. 74 – 2007 forward for passage, seconded by Councilman Peters. ORDINANCE NO. 74 – 2007 WAS PASSED BY A ROLL CALL VOTE OF 8 YES. .SECOND READING ORDINANCES AND RESOLUTIONS 16. NEW AND MISCELLANEOUS BUSINESS ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN I think I have request from our Safety Service Director that he wants to bring us up to date on the city’s recycling program. So I think I’ll take this opportunity to let him do that. SAFETY SERVICE DIRECTOR LOUDIANA – It’s always a pleasure to come before this body and give you some good news. We now have all the recycle bins in at the Wampler Park these bins collect steel, aluminum cans, glass, paper and cardboard. We still have the garage open until 6:00 you can take your yard waste down there and all other recyclables. So hopefully that will make everybody happy. COUNCILMAN PETERS Mr. Loudiana, maybe I missed it. Is it for plastic also or did you say plastic? SAFETY SERVICE DIRECTOR LOUDIANA – Plastic, yes, I’m sorry, yes. COUNCILMAN PETERS Okay, okay. SAFETY SERVICE DIRECTOR LOUDIANA – Plastic, steel and aluminum cans cardboard, paper. COUNCILMAN MANSON – Do we have anything for yard waste? SAFETY SERVICE DIRECTOR LOUDIANA – Yes, yard waste is collected at the city garage on Walnut Road. Again, that’s open only there. .REMARKS OF DELEGATIONS AND CITIZENS TO MATTERS NOT ON THE AGENDA KEN JOSEPH – Representing Emergency Medical Transport 1118 Main Avenue West, Massillon. I have hand outs for council members can I give these out now? ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Yes, just please hand them to Councilman Manson, he’ll pass them around. KEN JOSEPH – I’m not a public speaker so I actually prepared something for myself to read. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Can we get a copy when you’re done? KEN JOSEPH – That’s actually what I passed around as well. It is a quite lengthy letter so instead of transcribing all of it I have included it as part of the record. COUNCILWOMAN FERRERO I just became aware of this evening. This is all new to us so this is a lot for us to intake I think, I don’t know if all of you know about this, but I just heard about for the first time this evening. So this is something I’m sure that will be a subject of conversation at our work session on the 30th of this month. COUNCILMAN PETERS – One question, when you have received this notice already. KEN JOSEPH – I received the notice on the 11th I believe is when it was dated the 11th. COUNCILMAN PETERS – Okay, and when is your service supposed to cease being part… KEN JOSEPH – Midnight the 22nd. COUNCILMAN PETERS – What’s that? KEN JOSEPH – Midnight on the 22nd. COUNCILMAN PETERS – We won’t be able to discuss this at our work session. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Mr. Joseph, I think this part that got skipped is exactly what is occurring now in this most recent letter that you received. KEN JOSEPH – I’m sorry I probably should have put that in first but I was nervous. I’ll go back I guess just the beginning of the month. Beginning of the month, I had a person inform me that this may happen toward the end of the month. But this was a rumor I kind of dispelled it I didn’t think it was the case. On the 10th I had an employee of mine call me that he had heard from another employee of the other service in Alliance that this was going to take place and I raised an eyebrow, but didn’t think much of it because I was still hoping that it couldn’t possibly be the case. I got a phone call on the 10th actually on the 11th I got a phone call on the 11th from the Massillon fire chief telling me that a letter was being mailed to me that would remove us from primary 911 service for the city; no hard feelings and sorry have a good day. Real short conversation and I did get the letter the next day. As soon as I collected myself and assembled myself that’s when I tried to advise council because I know there is just this meeting that we’re slated for removal from primary service on the 22nd. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Councilman Maier, it is your committee, police and fire committee I think that has dealt with these issues before; is that correct? COUNCILMAN MAIER – That’s correct. I was not aware of these issues until Mr. Joseph called me. Let me get this straight now. You are being removed from the 911 service rotation because you’re not in compliance with the protocol at this time. KEN JOSEPH – The reason given initially on the telephone was that we didn’t have matching protocols. Protocols I guess to give some background because I know I hate it when people say thing I don’t know exactly what it means. If I’m patronizing at all with anybody who does understand it please for give me because I’m not trying to that I want to bring everybody up to the same page. But protocols is how paramedics treat patients we can do nothing without orders written orders from a doctor. Our protocols I guess in the beginning of the year our protocols were much closer to Stark or to Massillon Fire’s than Stark Ambulances were to my knowledge. But all three operations actually used the different protocols which is actually very common for entities to work together and have different protocols. We, I guess now Stark/Summit does have what I’ve been told identical matching protocols to Massillon Fire. We’ve been working on them and been having problems following with this SCMCB board to get these protocols. We apparently missed the letter that was mailed to us I don’t know what happened with that exactly. But I have suspicions but I don’t know what happened to it, but my understanding is that they’re overbooked or something and they don’t want to take on any new services because they have plenty. We’re a very large ambulance service probably one of the biggest in the area anyhow. I guess I could understand that; we have our own medical directors actually because of our size we’ve got three. What we decided to do I make the protocols identical which we can do probably takes two weeks or less the papers are already signed and we just wait for our letter to come back that says “now its time to function under the protocols”. Then our protocols will be identical to Massillon Fire’s with I mean the periods in same place, everything except it will have our initials on the bottom of it so we know it’s our copy. So in that it actually may happen before the 22nd although all three services have been operating since we’ve been in town under three different protocols and prior to us ever coming to town 10 years ago the other provider Stark/Summit got their own protocols with their own medical directors completely because they wanted some different things in them and it never was an issue for 10 years. It just all of a sudden out of the blue became an issue and we did immediately go to work on it as soon as we were requested to do that we immediately sent out letters to start into place. COUNCILMAN MAIER – Okay, it’s my understanding that this body passed a legislation a while back to get everybody on the same protocol. Are you aware of that? KEN JOSEPH – No. COUNCILMAN MAIER – Okay, we did pass legislation a while back to get everybody on the same page and make sure everyone had proper equipment to best serve these citizens of Massillon. I don’t know if this is part of what you’re talking now. How long would it take you to get back to where you’re supposed to be according to protocol then? You said about two weeks? KEN JOSEPH – Well, we actually our protocols we operate under now are fine. COUNCILMAN MAIER – Well, apparently they’re not because they’re asking you not to run. So I guess they’re not in compliance with what the fire department wants who is the lead authority of the city for what we’re trying to do. What we want to do is just make sure everyone can communicate and get along. (Right) And that’s the main thing so you said it’d take a couple of weeks to get that back in place? KEN JOSEPH – To have matching protocols I’m thinking its going to take two weeks maybe less than that. COUNCILMAN MAIER – Okay, once that’s done I would see of no problem you know then trying to back into rotation. But I understand you know if there’s a problem with matching protocol that’s what we were trying to do a while back and we had a lot of discussion on it. KEN JOSEPH – We were asked to do this in I believe March; we were asked to match the protocol with the protocol being used by Massillon Fire Department which like I say before that there had been three different ones used between the three providers. We immediately requested to be notified or I’m sorry to be under the direction of actually initially the letter we got just said to have matching protocols. We started that process within probably a day or two in discussion with the fire chief I advised him that it was going to be an easy process to do. Our medical director I was going to send the papers over and have him sign them and he said “no, no I want you under the SCMCB” which is a medical direction board that’s available. So then we sent our letter to them they’re advising that they sent one we didn’t get one. COUNCILMAN MAIER – Okay, so somewhere along the line it’s been lost in the shuffle. I guess the point that I’m trying to make is you’re saying that your service and the fire department and the other service were going three different directions. I can see where the efficiency would be a lot better if you were going one direction. So I guess I understand what’s going on and I don’t want to see any of these folks lose any of their jobs. But I guess we all need to be on the same page. That’s what we should do and if we need to sit down with the fire chief and get that going you know that’s fine. But it’s not advantageous to the citizens for three different entities to be going three different directions either. So I can you know if that’s what’s going on. KEN JOSEPH – I can appreciate that it would be that it isn’t a bad idea to have the protocols to be the same. We’ve never said that we weren’t going to do it; we’ve never refused to do it. We’ve operated and we are today still our crew went out since we’ve been here on a call. We’re operating together fine, the protocol differences is are minuet, very minuet and will be identical probably I mean it’s likely that they’ll be identical by the end of the week. I don’t know as soon as I can get my paperwork mailed back to us we can start using the new protocol. The identical protocol to the fire department, but the difference is now don’t really dictate a difference in patient care. There’s not short comings in it there’s nothing there they’re minuet. They’re minuet wordings and things that there’s no big changes in how anybody’s treated its they’re almost all identical. I can not lie to you and tell you that they’re identical. But they’re almost identical and will not pose any problem a bigger problem would be posed by actually taking us and making us unavailable or making us not being able to use. COUNCILMAN MAIER – Okay, I’m going to relinquish to Councilman Manson. COUNCILMAN MANSON Yeah, I’d just like to ask one question. You say that you didn’t receive this letter did we have a dated letter that went to Stark Ambulance and them to back this up. That’s my only question. COUNCILMAN MAIER – Does anyone, Mr. Loudiana, do you know can you shed light on whether there was a letter went out and it didn’t come from council. So… KEN JOSEPH – The letter we didn’t get wasn’t from the city. We got the letter from the city and the conversation because that was done in person and followed up by a letter. We didn’t get a letter back from when we sent our request in to try to follow the SCMCB board when they apparently sent us one that said that they were overtaxed or something right now and they didn’t want to take on another service. We still don’t have that although it’s been confirmed that it was sent one of my people went and talked to them and said that’s been the case. COUNCILMAN MAIER – But you were aware that the city was trying to get that out in place. KEN JOSEPH – That the city wanted us under the same protocols? Yes. COUNCILMAN MAIER – Okay. I guess that was my question, Mr. Loudiana. COUNCILMAN MANSON That was kind of my question I want to know where’s this letter that went out that these guys got or didn’t get and given time to comply? ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN I recognize Mr. Manson for his previous remarks and I will ask the safety service director to please come to the microphone. SAFETY SERVICE DIRECTOR LOUDIANA – I’d like to address those issues, but Mr. Joseph had contacted and received the services of an attorney our position is mute right now. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Mr. Townsend? COUNCILMAN TOWNSEND – Now, Mr. Joseph, you stated that you learned back in March that you had to match protocols. (Right) Now did you say that from March to July there came a several times or a few times the protocols? KEN JOSEPH – I’m sorry I didn’t understand the question. COUNCILMAN TOWNSEND – You had mentioned that you learned that you guys had to match protocol back in March. KEN JOSEPH – Right, some time in March I don’t remember if it was the middle or… COUNCILMAN TOWNSEND – Did it change, did that protocol change maybe a couple of times from March to July? KEN JOSEPH – We were initially asked to change to the protocols without anything saying that we had to be under this SCMCB board but then later and it wasn’t in our letter later in a verbal conversation the gears changed and it was supposed to be the SCMCB board also. But it wasn’t in our letter we still don’t have a letter that says that. But that was what the request had changed to so then we re-geared back up to go and follow with them rather than using our medical directors which we pretty much always used. COUNCILMAN TOWNSEND – So you received all this information back in March? KEN JOSEPH – Yes. COUNCILMAN TOWNSEND – I guess I’m playing devil’s advocate here. If it takes maybe one to two weeks to do that and you received the letter back in March here its July four months later. KEN JOSEPH – That’s the difference. We had to request the protocol from this board which we did. It was difficult to get a hold of them I was able to finally able to fax a letter to them to a Mr. Zonovich over to them and then he got it and then he gave it to the board apparently. I didn’t get follow up I called; I sent emails and such to ask how things are going you know times going by how are things going. I wasn’t getting anything back from them they don’t have I don’t believe anyway that they have a full time office staff they have part time I think help. Then that’s also again the benefit why I’m saying our medical director doing the protocol change with our medical director I have a home phone number for all of them. I can call them any time they can give us advise what they need what they think. So doing it with our own medical directors I could have had it done way before anybody had theirs done because in house medical direction it makes it simple. We numerous emails attempt to get updates on what’s going on with the board actually Massillon fire chief was able to find out before I was that we didn’t that we were not being put under that protocol or not under that protocol but under their direction. Protocol isn’t an issue so once I did have confirmation that was the answer that we at that point turned to our medical directors will you do this and their answer was absolutely there’s no problem to match Massillon’s protocol that’s not an issue. But the delay was back and forth and back and forth with the board and I also have feelings as to why maybe why that took a long time, but I’m not we did everything we could possibly do to get it done as fast as we could. Once it was back in our hands to use our own medical direction phone calls were made over the weekend actually and we have our papers signed; should actually be in the mail. So… COUNCILMAN MANG – Yes, what is SCMCB? Stark County Medical what? KEN JOSEPH – Stark County Medical Control Board. COUNCILMAN MANG – Okay, who are they? KEN JOSEPH – It’s a board of doctors that more or less come up protocols that they feel are appropriate medical treatments of patients that they feel are appropriate. COUNCILMAN MANG – They are a recognized body for Stark County? KEN JOSEPH – Yeah, they’re… COUNCILMAN MANG – Do they have jurisdiction over all emergency units that are operated in Stark County? KEN JOSEPH – No. Just whoever falls under them or whoever requests to be under their direction? COUNCILMAN MANG – How do you fall under them? KEN JOSEPH – You have to apply to them and ask for them to be your medical direction and they sign your paperwork and such. COUNCILMAN MANG – Okay, how is this board, is this a private company? KEN JOSEPH – It is not public, it is private. I can’t speak as to how it’s made up, but its not part of the county and it’s not a public board. It’s I’m pretty certain a private closed board. COUNCILMAN MANG – I’m kind of confused that I thought maybe this was the body that was overseeing all the medical transporting of whatever of anything in the county. It appears that this is not that, this is a board that can direct and do whatever, but… KEN JOSEPH – It’s not required of any ambulance to be under the board. It is optional to be under the board. It’s you choose to… COUNCILMAN MANG – Well, I guess my concerns is make up of boards and who’s on the boards and a lot of things. I can see a governing body and I do respect the fact that operations in the City of Massillon would all be under we’ll call it protocol if you wish where everybody has the same procedures of doing whatever. Whether it be the fire department, whether it be you or whether it be whomever that is handling any of our medical problems that we have in the city that are being authorized by the city to go there. Another words you’re an authorized unit to go there as far as I know and I can see where then it would be since the fire chief is the head of this would be the one who would have directions to make certain that all the people who are responding to these emergency calls would all be going under the same book page one, two, three, four and five. I understand that. The emphasis here about the possibility of the board being too busy to look at your application that’s kind of scary. I guess my questions lie in that area because you’ve inferred that another operator in the city a member is part of this board. I don’t have a problem with that only if its there for advisory status and things that goes on in the nature of the field. But if he or she is not a doctor or a nurse in the medical profession I guess I have a problem. But my problem I guess is with the board not having time if that was so inferred to look at your application to make certain that you do conform and if you don’t conform that they would immediately come back to you and say “two’s out of order you’re in four or something like that”. If the answer from what you stated is that they didn’t have time or whatever they didn’t have upsets me more than anything at this point. COUNCILMAN MAIER – Yes and I don’t mean to jump ahead of people here. There was a statement by Mr. Loudiana that there is some lawyers involved and I don’t know how much more we should get into here and it would be my suggestion that we just allow him to make his statements at this point and maybe talk to our law director before we go much further. KEN JOSEPH – Can I mention something about that? My attorney I did ask about what next and I use him a lot for reference to make sure I don’t say anything that is a problem as well. But he spoke with your law director there was no threat or anything of any litigation and such. As a matter-of-fact he told my attorney that I should talk to you folks that’s how it was left. There was no threat there was nothing at all like saying “we’re going to sue immediately, we’re going to this or that”. I was actually told to talk to members of council. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Mr. Joseph, if I could members of council get back to my question of a while ago which is exactly then what does this action do to you. Because I think you continued to sort of skip over that part. You told us the whole history of what you’ve heard through the grapevine and what people told you. But what exactly is the fire chief telling you is going to happen on the 23rd? KEN JOSEPH – On the 23rd we would be removed as the primary 911 service for the city and basically would be called if Stark/Summit couldn’t come to stuff but they would be given all the calls in the entire city. On the 23rd or 22nd at midnight however you want to look at that as the moment the 23rd starts that our calls would pretty much stop. COUNCILMAN MANSON Safety service director brought up about this person has an attorney or whatever. Is there some kind of legal action been taken against us or anything or is this just an advisor to his business. I mean we have law people who advise our business I think they have a right to have a legal advise from an attorney. I don’t think that should stop discussion of this stuff. COUNCILMAN PETERS – I guess and I’m not taking a side for the city or for you, Mr. Joseph. Council, I don’t know that we…this isn’t our job; this isn’t our job to worry about making decisions for the fire chief. This was done by our department head that’s what the city pays him for. We are legislators I mean I understand Mr. Joseph coming to us and I respect him for that including us but I without speaking to the law director myself what are our choices? We can’t stop this or put it forward or do anything like that unless there’s legislation to be passed or turned down. So I don’t know that its in our hands ultimately and I mean I don’t know how to say that nicely but it really isn’t city council’s job to do this that’s what we’re paying the fire chief for and if for some reason and I’m not saying he is or you are. But if for some reason the chief is doing this he probably has a reason and I maybe I would like to hear that reason and so would the other members of council but its really not our job to do anything here right now at this point. I mean we’re not being asked to pass something or turn down something. Although I would really like the chief to share with us what’s going on I mean I would like to know. But there’s I don’t know if we can do anything. Somebody correct me if I’m wrong or help me out here, but that’s really how I feel. COUNCILWOMAN CATAZARO-PERRY I did want to ask a question to Ken about I’m not quite understanding did you get your protocols done and into this board or did you send in a letter saying “you want to be under their direction” and you never got the letter back saying they’re too taxed? KEN JOSEPH – That’s what happened. We sent a letter in to the board I called and verified that it was received was able to make that contact and never got anything back. I’m not pointing fingers on you know somebody did or didn’t mail it or whatever we could have lost it. I don’t think that would happen but we never got a response over and over more than one time a week, every week tried email or phone call and different contact methods to find out what was going on. We haven’t delayed or drug our feet or anything like that and as soon as I had confirmation that they weren’t going to do it for us we took matters into our own hands with our own medical direction got the approvals actually over the weekend and it has to be mailed to the state as soon as they mail it back to us we’re ready to roll. COUNCILWOMAN CATAZARO-PERRY So did you notify the chief when they finally told you that they would accept you underneath their direction? KEN JOSEPH – Actually, he notified me. He sent them well I think he talked to them from talking with him I believe he spoke to someone over there that did call him back. Because I actually got my information on the where’s and why’s from him. I did send a person one of my people to go track down one of these doctors and ask. Once it was confirmed we immediately started on the method that I would have like to do in the first place, but I was trying to comply exactly. COUNCILWOMAN CATAZARO-PERRY Did the chief say that once you comply that you’re back in or what did he say about that? KEN JOSEPH – No, he didn’t tell us anything like that. There a few months ago I guess we also had a letter similar to this that didn’t give a reason it just put Stark as the primary ambulance service EMT as a back up. Now if you I come into council and before anything much happened with that I came in because we got it with no explanation it just said “this is how it is” and it wasn’t to do with any protocols or any short comings or anything. It just said effective such and such a date I don’t have it with me I should have brought it. Effective such and such a date we would no longer be the primary for the west side of Massillon we would be back up in case the other ambulance couldn’t come same thing. The Mayor stepped up and said he’s stopping that there would be no change to that he made the comment here in council and they resented that. Since that time we started having more and more things that we needed to change this we want you to do this we need these heart monitors; we did it all. We bought I mean heart monitors hell the shipping cost almost $500.00 to have these things sent to us over night but I wanted them immediately so that they knew we were serious about following everything as fast as we could. COUNCILWOMAN CATAZARO-PERRY Can I interrupt and ask you a question? (Yes, I’m sorry) So is the chief okay with you using your own medical directors now that this board can not accept you under their direction? Is he okay with that? KEN JOSEPH – I can’t answer to that. I’ve not been in discussion with this since I got the letter. COUNCILWOMAN CATAZARO-PERRY Okay, that’s all the questions I have. COUNCILMAN PETERS – I’ve got one more question; but its for the safety service director if you could bring him back up. Mr. Loudiana, just I don’t know maybe I’m out of line in asking this if I am you can tell me so and I won’t be mad at you. But isn’t there I mean is this something is people’s lives in danger that this has to happen on the 22nd or the 23rd of this month and can’t the city show a little better faith maybe and talk about this a little bit maybe with some members of council or people so we’re a little clearer on it. I mean just that’s my only problem with this whole thing it seems like its you know being rammed down everybody’s throat and I don’t’ know that I don’t’ feel comfortable with that. I feel comfortable with the chief’s decisions whatever they may be but is there something else that can be done to help this gentleman and his employees. I mean that’s what I’m looking at. SAFETY SERVICE DIRECTOR LOUDIANA – Well, as you know the chief is very thorough. (Yes, I do) He’s done an exceptionally long study over this and he came to the Mayor and I we discussed it and that was the decision that was made. But be honest with you I don’t know how they came up with the cut off date, but you have to cut off somewhere. So… COUNCILMAN PETERS – You answered my question, thank you. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Mr. Joseph, I’d like to thank you for coming down and making us aware of your situation if you want to sum this thing up I’ll give you a minute or so. Then we’ll ask others in the audience to come forward if they want to. KEN JOSEPH – I guess the key thing with me is right now we are being mandated by order of the fire department to maintain two 24 hour paramedic crews staffed and ambulances, three trucks, two trucks staffed around the clock three on the premise 24 hours a day 7 days a week. I don’t know what has been mandated with the other provider my understanding is that they have two trucks like we do have around the clock 7 days a week. But if they have to and we have to without us there’s two unless there’s a mandate for four. So if there is a time that you want us not to be in the city I would think that the only way not to drop a service was to mandate the other service to put on four trucks a minimum around the clock so that you have what you’ve got today. Anything different than that is less coverage to the city which I mean that’s written in stone valid point its not a point from somebody who wants business or that’s trying to get calls. There’s four trucks 24 hours a day in the city now and that’s a minimum staffing we go up and down I’m sorry we go up from that only not down. My understanding is that the other provider keeps two also probably goes up from that. But with the mandate being that we keep two and them also with two unless there’s a mandate put on them prior to us being pulled out for whatever length of time there’s going to be less. Which is again I don’t understand the date on this and I would absolutely welcome the fact of any council members sitting in with any discussions between my service and the fire department. I would like nothing better than to have more people beyond just myself and the fire department because I think it would really greatly add to the decision making process and such as well. COUNCILMAN MANG – What would happen on the 22nd everything being equal or midnight the 23rd being a back up provider is there any mandates for you have to x amount of equipment. The way you were presently set up in the rotation basis you were mandated to have two is that correct? (Yes) Now if you’re taken out of the rotation basis and you’re only used as a back up is there a mandate? KEN JOSEPH – That’s never been discussed with us. We’ve never been told there was or there wasn’t or I honestly don’t think that we’re expected to be here past then personally. But we’ve never been told what would make us a back up. COUNCILMAN MANG – The thing that bothers me about everything here is that the facilities that you’re going to is now in Perry Township. We don’t have you running to Massillon City so our providers are both either going to Perry Township or going into Canton. So it looks like our needs are more than they were up until Massillon City’s been in the position that its in. As I understand most of the people are directing themselves and I would imagine even the ambulances are directing themselves to a facility that they can handle their situation. So I’m not sure what we’re doing here if we’re getting down to only having one ambulance here and the other is already in Perry or on its way to I don’t know where I’ve got a lot of concerns if in fact he is only a back up he’s not even in rotation and that only means well if we do need you we’ll call you. I don’t know why he would even have anybody there’s I hope the direction of this thing is being looked at in every direction so that we as citizens and the people that we represent and I’m not getting into the ambulance thing here my only question is getting people to where they need to get as quick as they can. I just hope that we’re looking at this the right way. I realize council’s in a position of listening, but I hope that the people who need to make these directions have been listening and have the concerns that I have and maybe they have and they’ve anticipated those and have worked those out. KEN JOSEPH – I actually pled the entire case of in your letter to the Mayor in an email. I actually called several times I wanted to get I shouldn’t say several I called two times I want to be clear with that. I couldn’t get a return call back from the Mayor so I sent an email with actually this information plus probably more before I was well, I received an email back from Frank and it said simply “the decision stands sincerely Francis Cicchinelli” that was it. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Thank you, Mr. Joseph. Thank you members of council; I’m going to ask that you go ahead now take your seat. See if there’s any other member of the audience that wishes to address city council on any matter that’s not on the agenda. SYVESTER MORGAN – I live at 1521 Walnut Road SE, Massillon. I’ve got a two part question. First one, the yellow strip on Walnut Road need to be redone. It was done earlier and it rained and it faded and we the board that I represent we want Walnut Road repainted the yellow stripe; the white stripe is good all we need is the yellow stripe. Okay, second part, housing, I was told that there was going to be some demolition of homes and maybe you can help me out, Mr. Loudiana. There’s houses on across the street from me and it needs to be leveled the owner of the home says that its in her daughter’s name, but her daughter don’t even live in Ohio. Okay, now that house is an eye soar every morning I got out of my bed I’ve got to look at it. The siding is falling off of it, the gutter spouts is falling down they don’t even mow the grass. I am tired of looking at it as a resident of Walnut. I’m in charge of from Walnut to Franklin School to keep it beautified I do my part now I want council to step it up. Also, on 16th Street it needs to be mowed all the way down its mowed in section. It’s cut, not cut, cut, not cut and if we’re going to beautify Walnut and 16th Street its got to be mowed. Then there’s a habitat house, the lady lives there she wants to put a garage take out of her own pocket build a garage and she wants to go from Walnut to her garage to move her garage back there’s a little section of area there and I’m thinking the city owns it I’m not for sure. But she came to me and asked me could I do anything about it. So I’m asking council now can you do anything. Thank you. ACTING COUNCIL PRESIDENT BRYAN Your two parter became a four parter but that’s okay. Is there anyone else who wishes to address city council on a matter that’s not on the agenda? 18. ADJOURNMENT COUNCILMAN PETERS – I move that we adjourn, seconded by all.
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